I'd have a drink with you.
I usually assume people I meet are straight. Given that I'm one of those men who does not have complete 'passing' privilege, it allows me to watch from a distance and decide if anything should be done in terms of topics of conversation or just plain flirting. That has been my default setting for going around identifying people's sexual orientation out of caution, I imagine. Until I realize that they are indeed, either queer or queer adjacent. That has led me to 'miss' opportunities and misread signals from men, believing they've been polite when they were indeed interested in me. But I think that sometimes it's better to err on the side of caution.
It's always interesting to watch people who tend to declare everybody either straight or gay. They live in the binary and have very rigid ideas of who is who and what is what. Gender roles are assigned and sexual orientation is a given for them. Like Bella, in this case, who automatically goes for the most obvious traits to identify the sexual orientation (and hence gender, according to her) of the people she sees. She got some surprises, though. And so did I. I misread the sexual orientation of two of the people (because of MY default setting) but was not really surprised by what I heard.
This week (April 6th) was the first International Asexual Day (Ace) and I think that's a great thing. Especially for people like Bella, who considers herself the 'basic gay person' -I don't think she is- and tends to categorize people based on a mental checklist that tells her who's who and what they are supposed to 'like'. Some of the terms that were thrown out in the video were:
Bisexual
Straight
Gay
Lesbian
Asexual
Allosexual
Heteroromantic
Of course, Bella is not alone when she dumps people in two categories. Many cis gay men -usually those who enjoy passing privilege- tend to dump other men in two categories: fuckable and non-fuckable and that's directly related to the way they perceive those men in the gay-straight binary (which of course, needs more nuance because Bi people, duh) and usually leave out all the subtlety that sexual attraction has. Yeah, gay men can be Ace, too. I think I dated one. From the jump, we clicked. We enjoyed each other's company, we went out to eat, and to the movies and to long walks along the river. We held hands and we kissed in cars and parking lots and benches and we never really had sex. Not once. And I knew that everything in him was in perfect working condition, mind you. Maybe he was Greysexual? Fraysexual? I'll never know. He was driving me crazy and I decided to call the whole thing off. I did want him in a bad way and the ambivalence was maddening. One of the things that surprised me though, was when Bella mentions that she identifies as 'more male' is attracted to straight women and believes that if she were younger she'd go the Trans way.
The whole 'attracted to straight women' kind of threw me a little bit. I -innocent me- thought that it was gay men who usually slept with and coveted straight men! -been there, done them- but apparently the ladies have the same dilemma. Just ask Bella.
XOXO
"We held hands and we kissed in cars and parking lots and benches and we never really had sex."
ReplyDeleteThis is a kind of sex, in my opinion
Oh, we had intimacy but we did not have sex.
DeleteI think he liked me but did not want to have sex with me. I did. I found him very sexually attractive.
XOXO
At times, I found a deep kiss much more enjoyable than a blowjob.
DeleteAbsolutely.
DeleteI totally agree. Some men CAN kiss.
XOXO
Usually, those who know how to kiss are very oral like me. I know how to kiss and also I'm a good blowjobber. But I'm 150% oral, so I'm skilled in everything is by mouth, from sweet kisses to swallowing. However, I can assure you that sometimes I got more pleasure kissing a man than blowjobbing/being blowjobbed! Lived experience, and not just once!
DeleteOh, I can totally believe that.
DeleteThat's your favorite sexual experience. I like sucking dick. I need to do a post on that.
XOXO
This video was very enlightening. We all bring our assumptions to these interactions. In your situation your caution may have been self-preservation, because gay bashing is a thing.
ReplyDeleteBella’s interactions were very interesting. Being a server she is very comfortable interacting with everyone and has no problem asking probing questions.
We do have to recognize that there is a segment of the community that is comfortable with little to no sex. And that’s ok. We need to be who we are comfortable being. And we need to recognize what we need in a relationship. If we’re not getting it, and after frank conversations, we need to make the decision that is right for us.
XOXO 👨❤️💋👨
Oh, yes.
DeleteGay bashing IS a thing. And Bella did have a talent to talk to people.
And there's a bigger percentage of people who really do not need sex than we think. Mismatched libidos can wreck a relationship as fast as money problems.
XOXO
I take people as they are, gay straight, or somewhere, anywhere, on the spectrum. I wish people could just be themselves and it doesn't mean anything. Is gender the only way, perhaps other than race, in which we segregate people? If not, I need to find the tall pale white gay guy with blue eyes segment ....
ReplyDeleteYes, that's true, especially when interacting socially.
DeleteBut what about when you find them attractive? Gender may become important then, unless you are Pansexual and that would imply you do care about the amount of sex you want in a relationship.
XOXO
I'm like bob; I'll drink with anyone and I don't care about color/orientation/etc. the only people with whom I WON'T drink are MAGAts!
ReplyDeleteOh, yes. That's for a drink.
DeleteI'd have a drink with anybody, but like you, I draw the line at the MAGAts. No Repugs in my list!
XOXO
I think once you feel it's necessary to begin breaking everybody up into categories you miss the purpose of being human. As someone who works in the public sector, I talk to everybody... even Republicans.
ReplyDeleteYou talk to everybody because they are paying you for it. That also speaks of your passing privilege, of course. Being a white cisgender male who does not have to worry about being perceived as queer makes things very easy in life.
DeleteBut when it comes to fucking (or not fucking) you need to know if that other person is compatible with you. Either they are or not.
XOXO
" cis gay men -usually those who enjoy passing privilege- tend to dump other men in two categories: fuckable and non-fuckable" Had me roaring, but so true.
ReplyDeleteAnd that line she said about "if she were younger she'd go the Trans way." didn't sit well with me. She made is sound like it's a causal decision and a quick choice to make, even though she probably didn't. I never care people people are. I ll talk to anyone, and have done straight men...but then are they really 100% straight to have sex with men? Even if it's just a blow?
Hahaha. But it's true! Some men only see two kinds of people.
DeleteAnd I was kind of thrown off by her comment, too. He seemed to be in her late forties or fifties (I cannot calculate age!!) and she said she lived through the seventies, so maybe being older she has more rigid notions of gender?
And that's the question about heterflexible men I keep asking myself...
A blow is sex, no matter what Bill Clinton said.
XOXO
Uh-huh. So, my wife watches "Married at First Sight" when she can't find anything else between Don Lemon and whatever is on at 8pm. There's one couple where the wife is always wanting to have sex, he keeps putting it off. An episode has him saying he needs a more spiritual connection. Now, today, here you present the assigned word. But, for me? All this does is place more labels. (Arrrgh, it seems every day there are more and more labels.) Don't you think we'd all be so much more at peace and happy if we just simply allowed people to be people? Stopped categorizing? No Black, Brown, White, etc; no gay, straight, bi, etc? XOXO
ReplyDelete"Married At First Sight" is my favorite reality show. At first I thought the Cajun guy was trans male. But I was wrong.
DeleteI've never watched that show! Should I? Some reality shows get to me.
DeleteAnd in a situation like that, knowing if the person is Ace or Demisexual would be super important. Some people can have sex at the drop of hat. Some people do not need it at all.
People can be people, but if we are going to have a relationship with them, we have to find out if we are compatible, no?
You'd probably have to disclose to a wife that you're Bi or Pansexual. Or you'd have to decide if your relationship is going to be open or closed and who would be able to fuck who. Categories come handy when doing that.
XOXO
Do we really need a label to enter a relationship? Mutual attraction comes first. Lasting relationships come about through time and conversation and various activities - the reason I would never do the Married at first Sight or even that 90-Day Fiance thing. Nope. I didn't say to my wife "Oh, I'm bi." before we were married. But she did know about the previous marriage and she did know about the relationships with men, just as I knew about her previous marriage and relationships. She happens to be lesbian magnate - the lesbians LOVE her - though she's never had sex with any of them. 😊 XOXO
DeleteJimmy, I can take it or leave it. Most of the "reality" shows I can easily take a pass.
DeleteSo there was some kind of disclosure before you married your wife, Big? That's kind of what I'm talking about. I would not wait until I'm married to tell my spouse "Oh, BTW I'm bi. LOL" . That'd be shitty. Even with mutual attraction, I've always entered in relationships with bisexual men knowing they were bisexual.
DeleteAnd I think I know some women to whom lesbians seem to gravitate....
XOXO
I don't think there was an actual discussion, disclosure. We'd both been working around the theatre and she knew of my (sort of) long-term relationships - one with a local weekend news anchor (woman) and one with a fellow dancer (guy). But, yeah, she knew before we started dating. XOXO
DeleteOh yes, I've known lesbians who have wasted their lives running after inaccessible straight women. Tragic, really.
ReplyDeleteI did not know that!
DeleteMaybe I should have more conversations with my lesbian friends. We have fun, but I really never talk to them much about THEIR relationships or their stories. I need to pay more attention.
XOXO
It seems odd to me to classify persons into categories based on preferred types of sexual behavior. We don't have a word or special category for people who drink tea instead of coffee, nor yet another classification for people who drink both -- not that we attach any importance to. And there are a lot of other variations in sexual attraction besides just which gender you're attracted to.
ReplyDeleteThere was a lot of homosexual attraction and behavior in ancient Greece and Rome, but no such concept as "a homosexual" as a category of person.
From the perspective of civil rights it sometimes makes sense to think of gay people as a distinct category because the historically-dominant religion has a taboo on homosexuality and has singled out people who engage in it for persecution. Without that problem, I don't think such a concept would serve any purpose.
But Infidel, having a conversation about sex is important when you're going to have sex with them . Even more important if you're going to have sex with them on a regular basis. And it's paramount when you're going to decide if you're going to have sex only with them.
DeleteI think gender is irrelevant unless it's important for the person. I know cis gay men who would not have sex with a Trans man. I know some who have. It depends on the person.
And you are right, sexual orientation is brought to the forefront by bigotry. Especially if a specific religion makes it a taboo, and most do, so I don't think that categorization will go away any time soon.
XOXO
Did I miss 'Lumbersexual" somewhere????
ReplyDeleteLOL
DeleteI was expecting 'Lumbersexual' with the guy with the flannel shirt?
XOXO
Intimacy is different than sex. They can happen at the same time or separately. I never think about people's sexuality until they give me a reason to. I try not to categorize. Unless they give me reason to. It's their business and just a small piece of who they are. More interested in their brain and how evolved they are. And kindness. I look for kindness. Now... I do play a game when I am bored... or used to - honey, it been awhile! - Would Ya, Could Ya? That's based on an instant assessment of energy and presentation. I do it with men and women. I'm always surprised by the stuff I will put up with if there's something that intrigues me. :) Kizzes. (Did I stay on topic??)
ReplyDeleteOh, And YOU? Sight unseen... we are having drinks, boo. You my kind of peep.
DeleteOh definitely.
DeleteAnd some people need intimacy to have sex. Some do not. I may take into consideration their sexual orientation only if my safety depends on my knowing. I have never been gay-bashed but one cannot rule that out. Especially when one does not have passing privilege.
Would ya, could ya sounds like a fun game! LOL I'd have to try and play it next time I go to a party. And yes, you stayed on topic.
And I'd have a drink with you in a heartbeat! LOL My friend has a cabin in Marcel, in Minnesota. If we ever go up there again, I'll make sure I'll drop yo a line. Who knows? I may make a detour to have a shot of Tequila (or something) with you.
XOXO